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LSU Student Planning to Burn American Flag in "Peaceful Protest"

Discussion in 'New Roundtable' started by CaseyLSU, May 11, 2011.

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mctiger RIP, and thanks for the music Staff Member

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OK, I officially apologize for bringing up that question in this thread

edit:
.....which I would not have done if not for the statement

spreading lies, like for instance telling little children that heaven exists.
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mctiger, May 12, 2011

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Rex_B Geaux Time

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Dear lord won't you buy me a ......

Rex_B, May 12, 2011

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mctiger RIP, and thanks for the music Staff Member

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Rex_B said: ↑

Dear lord won't you buy me a ......
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Man, why does that song keep coming up? Heard it on the radio about two days ago. Then, my brother in law was singing it last night while we were filling sandbags. And here it is again.

mctiger, May 12, 2011

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lsu99 whashappenin

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mctiger said: ↑

At the risk of derailing the thread, prove heaven doesn't exist.
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I think the problem with heaven is that most people get too specific about it. I have no doubt there is something more to "life" than our time on earth. Exactly what that means, I haven't a clue. I'm fine with that.

lsu99, May 12, 2011

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Bud Lee Call me buttercup

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LaSalleAve said: ↑

What if the guy that burned the flag came out with a "don't tread on me" flag and burned the American flag because he didn't want to be a part of Obama's America? I bet some of you would sing a different tune.
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Just saw this....no...in no way would I approve just because the burners message changes. I don't buy into the whole "it is a sign of how free we are" bullschite and I don't see how it gets your message across. You want to get your message across...do it like they did for the Jena 6. Announce you will march and why, show up and march holding signs that express your cause, and then go home.

Burning a flag is like pissing on your mother's rug because you disagree with what she was cooking for dinner. Are you free to do so...sure...are you getting your message accross in a way that she will listen...no. You are just being disrespectful.

Bud Lee, May 12, 2011

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Bud Lee Call me buttercup

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lsureveille's write up about yesterday

A jeering crowd swarmed after communication studies graduate student Benjamin Haas on the Parade Ground this afternoon after he outraged many students and community members with an announcement that he planned to burn an American flag.

Though Haas didn't burn the flag as he originally announced yesterday on Facebook, the mob of people tore after Haas until he slipped into a police car and was escorted off campus by police.

Haas did not have the needed permit to burn a flag, which is why an actual flag burning did not take place, according to LSU Media Relations.
After chasing Haas off campus, the group of more than 1,000 straddled Highland Road, shouting a back-and-forth banter of "GO AMERICA" and "GO TIGERS."

"I initially began this flag burning protest to define due process for students and suspected terrorists alike, to call on LSU and universities across the country to defend basic human rights and avoid putting students into the criminal justice system when it can be taken care of internally," the pre-written text of Haas's speech read. "In the name of peace, there will be no flag burning today. This country and the flag that flies over it stands for freedom, democracy, love, peace and the ability to question our government."

Haas attempted to recite his speech a few times, but the crowd cut him off, chanting "U-S-A" as horse-mounted police worked their way through the maze of people, pushing them back and eventually escorting Haas off campus in a police cruiser.

Ryan Nuckolls, agricultural business sophomore, said Haas is one of his instructors, and he spoke to Haas about the burning yesterday. Nuckolls, adorned in American flag attire, said Haas said he was "protesting unfair persecution of Isaac Eslava" — the University student arrested last week for vandalizing and burning a University American flag — because Eslava should be innocent until proven guilty.

Burning an American flag is protected by the First Amendment under freedom of speech.

Nuckolls said Haas is an open-minded instructor, but he did not approve of Haas's actions today.

"He's a patriotic person and takes pride in his rights," Nuckolls said, but reiterated that he did not approve of Haas's activity and told him such when they talked yesterday.

Before Haas was scheduled to burn the flag, Shelby Taylor, communications studies student, spoke out for Haas's right to burn the American flag, further enraging the crowd.

"Even if this is just publicity ... I respect that he has the right do do this," Taylor said, as Douglas Ducote, US Army Staff Sgt., thrust his Operation Iraqi Freedom hat in her face and yelled at her.

"It's my flag too!" Taylor cried, as the crowd countered her yelling, "Go to hell, hippie, go to hell!"

Ducote, who said he served four combat tours in Iraq, said he felt like screaming at Taylor was a flashback, as he suffers from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.

"I watch my brothers and sisters die next to me and come home with this wrapped around their coffins," he said, gripping an American flag.
Ducote and many others waved flags in the air throughout Haas's chase, and one flag stood out as John Savoie, construction management sophomore, held a yellow flag with "Noli Me Calcare," spanning it. Savoie said the Latin phrase translates to "don't tread on me," and he and his fraternity made the flag as a replica of the "original flag used in the Revolutionary War."

A University student who called herself "Loko," and a Daily Reveille employee identified as Jessica Seaman, national resource ecology and management major, walked with Haas as he left the Parade Ground said she "personally would never be engaged in burning a flag," but she supports the "right to assemble," which is a "beautiful part of being American."

Following Haas being escorted out of the area, the crowd thinned, though many stayed for a "patriotic assembly" organized by Student Government President and Vice President Cody Wells and Kathleen Bordelon.
Wells said he "could not be more proud" of the reaction to Haas's behavior and Bordelon said when she initially created the event yesterday, she expected around 80 people. Wells and Bordelon invited veterans to stand behind them as they recited the Pledge of Allegiance as the bell tower's chimes rang through the Parade Ground.

A trumpet player then played the National Anthem as the crowd sang along.

Not only University students attended the protest, but several community members attended as well, including veterans and members of the Baton Rouge Tea Party.

Rebecca Favre Lipe, vice president of the Baton Rouge Tea Party, said she was "amazed" at the demonstration of patriotism from attendees.
"We have First Amendment rights, but there's also respect," Lipe said.
People began to gather in Free Speech Plaza around 11 a.m., where Sarah Kirksey and Hunter Hall, communications studies seniors, distributed 134 American flags they bought. As an incensed crowd snaked through Free Speech Plaza, a line of on-lookers watched from the terrace of the Union.
Two women who asked to remain unnamed brought signs reading "Benjamin Haas is a terrorist" and "You hate my flag but love my freedom."
One of the women said she labeled Haas as a terrorist because "anybody that hates America is a terrorist."

Though LSUPD rode through the protest on horseback before it began, LSU PD Lt. Jeff Metzger said their role was to "keep it peaceful
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On the news last night the blonde wearing the American flag top that was with Hass was interviewed and I thought she summed it up nicely, basically when asked what she thought about the counter protesters that they probably feel like that succeeded, but both sides was able to assemble and be heard and that is what makes this country great.

Bud Lee, May 12, 2011

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lsu99 whashappenin

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It seems as though most of the articles I've read don't mention the details of Eslava's arrest. If he stole the flag, was in a stolen car, with drugs, etc; that would be relevant information. I'm just not sure what Haas is attempting to defend.

lsu99, May 12, 2011

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LSUsupaFan Founding Member

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Bud Lee said: ↑

lsureveille's write up about yesterday

On the news last night the blonde wearing the American flag top that was with Hass was interviewed and I thought she summed it up nicely, basically when asked what she thought about the counter protesters that they probably feel like that succeeded, but both sides was able to assemble and be heard and that is what makes this country great.

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Seems pretty clear to me the burner does not understand the difference between theft and oppression. Also pretty clear that the counter protesters don't understand what freedom is about.

LSUsupaFan, May 12, 2011

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mctiger RIP, and thanks for the music Staff Member

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LSUsupaFan said: ↑

Seems pretty clear to me the burner does not understand the difference between theft and oppression. Also pretty clear that the counter protesters don't understand what freedom is about.
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I'm not so sure. See, when I look at an American flag, I don't just see Freedom of Speech. I see every right, privilege and freedom that citizenship in this nation affords me. And I see every person who has fought and died to preserve those freedoms. Maybe the flag burner makes a little speech like Martin proposed: "I am burning the flag as an exercise of my right to free speech to protest Injustice XYZ." But I question his sincerity, because there are other ways to express this outrage. Why not make a sign of the BRPD's logo and burn that? Burn a copy of The Advocate where the guy's arrest was headlined? For that matter, why burn anything at all? Why not just make a sign that expresses your view and get on a bullhorn for awhile?

As many of you have pointed out, a flag is just a symbol; its not imbued with magical qualities. But to people who get upset about flag burning, the flag is a symbol of everything the nation is about, not just one or two aspects that upset the radical du 'jure. You burn a flag, you defile everything the nation stands for.

mctiger, May 12, 2011

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LSUsupaFan Founding Member

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mctiger said: ↑

As many of you have pointed out, a flag is just a symbol; its not imbued with magical qualities. But to people who get upset about flag burning, the flag is a symbol of everything the nation is about, not just one or two aspects that upset the radical du 'jure. You burn a flag, you defile everything the nation stands for.
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What you are saying is the symbol is more important than the actual freedom it represents. Our flag looks pretty cool, but when someone gives their life in defense of America it is not in defense of the flag. It is to defend the ideals this nation stands for. One of those is that we are a nation so free that we are even protected to say things everyone hates. I really don't know if people who burn flags recognize the irony that they are biting the hand that feeds, but it doesn't even matter to me.

If you want to live in a land where disrespecting government symbols is frowned upon there are plenty of dictatorships around. I prefer American style freedom.

I'll bow out with this line from Futurama.

Dr. Zoidberg:
Yes, fellow patriots, I ate your flag. And I did it with pride. For to express oneself with doing a thing is the very essence of Freedom
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LSUsupaFan, May 12, 2011

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