I just don't see how blaming an administration for the.... what's the use... martin put it well with the whole beating post.... I'm gonna leave you to your paranoa for now. I still don't get it. Matter of fact, I'm more confused now than ever. :huh:

:dis::nope:
So sad!

sdm, you did not answer my question. you posted lots of cut and paste on the operations at waco.

my specific question was....

in response to...

Fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me see the Elian Gonzalez case.

Yet again I disagree with the tactics used in this case by the ATF.
This was a domestic dispute between a father in Cuba and his relatives in Florida who was keeping his son after his wife drowned or something here in the states.

I have no clue why the president of the US would get involved here?
His attorney Greg Craig was the fathers attorney.
If you want to reunite the boy and father fine but you don't need the ATF to raid the house, break down doors and point guns at everyone in the house.
I believe it could have been resolved a more civil way.
These people weren't kooks and yet some of the same tactics were used that were present at Waco.
This makes the patriot act look like a walk in the park and yet some want to ignore or deny it.

Whats up with you?
You are so impatient?
I am not on here all night I just got home.
I have to take my children to school and do other things also.
I probably will later but really?
Why should I say anything else here, I think you have totally ignored what I have said and proven last night.
If people choose to ignore this fine the conversation will end.

i did not ignore anything. i read the posts and they did not address what was the govts role in the murder of men, women, and children in okc. i asked a question, you posted lots of copy and paste, it did not answer my question, so i asked again, in case you didnt understand my question. quite simple, really.

You are right i didn't address that because I was still responding to your other post.
Well you didn't give me the proper amount of time to do it because I was still responding to your last post about the hostage negotiators, these situations didn't have to happen.

You seem pretty impatient of which I simply don't understand why you have a problem with me doing the research to prove that none of what you posted in that post was necessary.

If I have any fault in anything I have said here it is not clarifying what I meant when I said governments role in all of this.
I never have claimed that the government had a role in Okc.
I would never do that unless I could prove it.
Everything that I have said and links I posted are based on truth to the best of my knowledge.

The only thing I will say about Okc which is speculation.
I have been told and read where some believe the damage to the Murrah building was to extensive to be done from a Ryder truck like the government claims.
The truth is I don't know, its another thing where we are only told probably half of what really happened.

excuses for mcveigh.

its just you. nothing more than an excuse for a deranged mass murderer's actions.

your words.

see above.

no different that the coaching rumor of my sister's hairdressers cousin's mechanic's next door neighbor.....

"some believe?" yeah, conspiracy theorist kooks.

we know what happened. timothy mcveigh, aided by terry nichols, parked a van full of ammonium nitrate fertilizer and racing fuel in front of the alfred p murrah federal building on april 19, 1995. at 9:01 the mega fertilizer truck bomb was set off on the side of the building that also housed the day care center. a day care center that could be seen through the front glass of the building mcveigh had scouted. the force of the blast sheered off the front of the building. 168 innocent men, women, and children were killed.

just where is (in your words) "the governments role in all this"? its a pretty simple question. you obviously have thoughts, or you would not have posted all of the above. it doesnt take research, all it takes is a simple explanation of what you believe.

I have already answered all the questions I have had and proved them with links and background information.
I have also said that I didn't excuse the actions of the guilty parties involved.
I have already stated yet again in my own words that the raid didn't have to happen and also proved it.
I now know why you were so anxious for my response, it was nothing more than an all out personal attack on me.
Attack the messenger instead of the message.
By the same token you want to totally ignore the actions of the government and you have the right to do so.

Bring proof and lets have a discussion about what I have said instead of name calling or don't waste my time.

please show me where i have name called. i have done no such thing. the only name calling was in response to "some have said". it is the "some" who are kooks. not once have i called you names or attacked you. i have asked for an explination of your beliefs. not cut and paste "proof" but your beliefs. what you think. you have said that if waco had not happened, okc would not have happened. i have also said that the govt f'ed up in waco but that i held the cultists that set fire to their own compound, refused to release innocent children in 51 days of a standoff, and allowed the sexual abuse of children primarily responsible for the tragedy. when you state that "if waco had not happened, okc would not have happened" it leads me to believe that you believe the govt had a role in okc. that is what i am trying to get an answer on, but you refuse. if that is your belief, then imo, you are offering excuses to a deranged mass murder. timothy mcveigh hated the govt and if it had not been waco, would have found some other reason to strike at the govt. okc was not just a mass murder of 168 innocent people, it was a strike at the govt of the united states of america, by an anti-government wacko.

how trying to get an explanation of what your beliefs are is a personal attack is beyond me. i am quoting what you have said and trying to get an explanation of those statements.