Biggio missed Hall of fame by 2 votes

Discussion in 'OTHER SPORTS Forum' started by islstl, Jan 8, 2014.

  1. islstl

    islstl Playoff committee is a group of great football men Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2003
    Messages:
    46,115
    Likes Received:
    9,705
    Olberman just ripped apart the Baseball Writers Assoc. of America for taking away Dan LeBatard's voting card this year. LeBatard had enlisted the help of deadspin to help him decide by having them ask people who to vote for.

    Olberman said that some voter back in 2007 in Houston had a Tequila party and had people help him decide. Another dude just this year admitted to voting for his 10th and final person by flip of a coin (between Bonds and Clemens). Yet another voter went to social media on twitter and asked fans about whether he should vote for Biggio and Kent. So Olberman wanted to know why banish LeBatard when you have these other idiots doing worse stuff?
     
  2. fanatic

    fanatic Habitual Line Stepper

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2003
    Messages:
    13,665
    Likes Received:
    6,012
    My guess (and that's all it is - a guess) is because LeBatard was so public about what he did. He mentioned it on his radio show for like a week. I don't doubt that those other incidents happened. I just never heard about any of them.
     
    Richdog likes this.
  3. BostonBengal

    BostonBengal Founding Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2003
    Messages:
    8,684
    Likes Received:
    296
    I respect Biggio. I respect him as a player and as a person in the community. He's had a great career (20+ years is amazing). However, I don't look at Biggio as a HOF player.

    Yes, he got over 3,000 hits. But over 20 years, you had better get there. But I'm trying not to "poo poo" his accomplishments. I just feel that there was never a point in Biggio's entire pro career that any opposing team feared him the same way they do/did for other players--even on his OWN team. No one ever walked Biggio to pitch to Bagwell. Biggio's spot in the order never gave an opposing manager headaches with how to approach him.

    Biggio deserves to be applauded for his career, deserves to be an Astro Fan favorite. Retire his number in Houston and put him in the Astro HOF. But the MLB HOF?? Well, he certainly wasn't the greatest, most feared catcher in the game when he was a catcher, and he wasn't the best 2B or the best CF either. He was a good player. No denying that. But he certainly wasn't a "great" one.
     
    fanatic likes this.
  4. islstl

    islstl Playoff committee is a group of great football men Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2003
    Messages:
    46,115
    Likes Received:
    9,705
    If we categorize Biggio as a 2nd basemen and a leadoff hitter, since that's what he was for roughly 80 % of his career, we would have to compare him to other 2nd basemen in the hall.

    So I would implore anyone to find me a 2nd baseman and/or leadoff hitter in the HOF that has:

    .281 Avg
    .363 OBP
    .433 SLG
    291 Homers
    668 Doubles (Only behind Speaker, Rose, Musial and Cobb)
    1844 Runs
    1175 RBIs
    414 Stolen Bases
    3060 Hits

    With all due respect BostonBengal, your description of Biggio would disallow pretty much all 2nd basemen from the HOF. You'd only have corner fielders and corner outfielders and a few catchers in your hall.

    Is Ryne Sandberg good enough?:

    .285 Avg
    .344 OBP
    .452 SLG
    282 Homers
    403 Doubles
    1318 Runs
    1064 RBIs
    344 Stolen Bases
    2386 Hits

    Joe Morgan?

    .271 Avg
    .392 OBP
    .427 SLG
    268 Homers
    449 Doubles
    1650 Runs
    1133 RBIs
    689 Stolen Bases
    2517 Hits

    Rogers Hornsby (considered the greatest hitting 2nd baseman of all time):

    .358 Avg
    .434 OBP
    .577 SLG
    301 Homers
    541 Doubles
    1579 Runs
    1584 RBIs
    135 Stolen Bases
    2930 Hits

    In the all important category of Offensive WAR (wins above replacement), Biggio is 46th in MLB history. Morgan is 17th and Sandberg is 94th. Hornsby is 10th.

    In WPA (win probability added), Biggio is 86th. Morgan is 10th, Sandberg is 117th.

    There are other important tell tale categories I could mention, all of which Biggio is highly ranked in the pantheon of baseball.

    He just didn't play for a long time. He played well for a long time. His stats did get watered down a bit in the last 5 seasons or so when he was a low .290 hitter.

    He went through a 5 year stretch as a leadoff hitter where he averaged nearly 20 homers, 80 RBIs, 35 stolen bases and 125 runs scored while hitting just over .300 and an OBP just over .400. He was the best leadoff hitter in the majors during this time.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2014
  5. shane0911

    shane0911 Helping lost idiots find their village

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2005
    Messages:
    37,558
    Likes Received:
    23,813
    CB absolutely belongs in the hall. Especially when you look at some of the names that are already in that were far less productive. Anyone that says otherwise is either a braves fan or just doesn't know crap about baseball.
     
    Richdog likes this.
  6. lsu99

    lsu99 whashappenin

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    3,015
    Likes Received:
    343
    Biggio started playing as a catcher when I was a teenager and didn't follow the Astros very closely. The Astros became my favorite team when I was at LSU and my roomate would watch and listen (introduced me to Milo) to games. I moved to Houston in 2001 and became an even bigger Biggio fan.

    When he got his 3,000th hit, my company gave me a couple of last minute tickets. He needed four hits so we obviously thought it was a long shot. He ended up getting five in that game and was thrown out trying to stretch a hit into a double.

    My wife was pregnant at the time and we had settled on "Quinn" as our (2nd) son's name. When I read the story about Biggio the next day, it said his wife and daughter Quinn met him on the field. That was the 3rd time I heard Quinn used as a girl's name so we changed our minds and went with James.
     

Share This Page