GoT Season 5 (warning: Spoilers)

Discussion in 'New Roundtable' started by LaSalleAve, Apr 12, 2015.

  1. mobius481

    mobius481 Registered Member

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    I agree. I guess I'm assuming it will end happily for someone. It's just that as soon as you think it's someone in particular, they get shanked. I too think John will come back. He has to. He's the only character left to root for.
     
  2. fanatic

    fanatic Habitual Line Stepper

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    I'm not necessarily hoping for a happy ending and I like the unpredictabilty (when it's actually unpredictable). I just think it's too slanted towards bad guys always winning.

    Yep, that's kinda what I was getting at. I love how dark the show can be at times. I love the somewhat unpredictability. But let the good guys get one over every so often.

    I know things make more sense to book reader, but since the show deviates from the books so often, it's really almost 2 different stories. Take Tommen, for ex. In the book, he's just a boy but in the show he's a teenager, so we can't really go by the book for his arc. The powers that be want us to believe that the Sparrows were able to gain power over the entire city, basically over night and the only 'muscle' (for lack of a better word) that they have are a few men armed only with wooden clubs. There's no way they would be able to defeat the heavily armed, trained and battle tested warriors in what's left of the Kings Guard/City Watch/Lannister army, no matter how few of them were left. (Ok, enough from me on this particular story line)
     
  3. mancha

    mancha Alabama morghulis

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    There are no winners in the Game of Thrones. Only temporary leaders. Everyone's flaw is exploited to their demise.

    Ned and Jon saw the big picture but did not see the danger in front of them. Rob's romantic love got him. Tywin's micromanaging absolute control of his kids lives did him in. Joffery's madness caused his assassination.
     
  4. fanatic

    fanatic Habitual Line Stepper

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    Not really the only one. I'm still rooting for Arya, Sansa, Bran, and Khalisi. And I'm still rooting against the Freys, the Boltons (Roose and Ramsey in particular), and possibly Littlefinger, depending on what he's up to. He probably still deserves to die because his conspiracy with Lysa Arryn that started the whole thing. And Ellaria. I want that bitch to eat a sword too. I'm sure I'm leaving someone else who's deserving out.

    I don't know. Robert ruled for nearly 20 years. And the Targaryens had a dynasty.
     
  5. mancha

    mancha Alabama morghulis

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    You can say that the game started when Robert was killed. His brashness and gluttony was his downfall. The Targaryen's inbred the shit out of themselves and created the mad king. The dynasty ended. Stannis believed in his destiny and that did him in.

    Most stories focus on the heroes strengths as the defining characteristic. Martin and the show writers focus on the character's flaws. At least that is my take on it.
     
  6. LaSalleAve

    LaSalleAve when in doubt, mumble

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  7. LaSalleAve

    LaSalleAve when in doubt, mumble

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    The game really started way before that. You could trace it back to Aegon the Conqueror but for those that only know the most current back story it's when Rhaegar kidnapped Lyanna Stark.

    Rhaegar was never a warrior, he was an obsessive reader and a musician. Then he read the prophecy of the Prince that was promised, (speculated) believed it to be himself and told Ser Willam Derry out of the blue "I will require a sword and armor, it seems I must be a warrior". He was married to Elia Martell had a son and it is thought he either kidnapped Lyanna Stark or she went willingly with him. I honestly think he kidnapped her to impregnate her because he realized he himself was not the Prince who was promised but one of his sons would be. And he needed Lyanna Stark to create a son who would fulfill that prophecy. She gave birth to Jon, that's what Lyanna made Ned promise on her death bed. That he would keep his lineage a secret until the time was right. If he had revealed it, Robert would want Jon dead. Now the only person in Westeros alive that knows the truth is Jojen and Meera's father, Howland Reed of Greywater Watch, the only living survivor of the Tower of Joy. The tower of joy scene is awesome... Here is a fanmade comic....

    https://mccomseycomix.wordpress.com/2012/08/20/the-tower-of-joy-an-adaptation/
     
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  8. mancha

    mancha Alabama morghulis

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    My point is that the characters are defined by their weakness, not their strength. Their weakness kills them. This is not a heroes tale.
     
  9. LaSalleAve

    LaSalleAve when in doubt, mumble

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    i don't see what Jon did as a weakness, I think what he did was the correct thing to do, and incredibly brave, but choices have consequences. It's about choices, and the consequences of those choices. It was Ned's choice to back Stannis and out the Lannisters that got him killed, it was Robb's choice to marry the other girl that got him and Catelyn killed, it was Cersei's choice to alienate everyone that got her where she is, it was Jon's choice to betray his vows or in the shows case to allow the Wildlings in that got him stabbed.

    Is loving your kids a weakness? Maybe, is risking your life to save a bunch of women and children from white walkers a weakness? Now Robb's could have been a weakness because he should have just married the Frey girl, but it was still a choice.

    Tywin Lannister had no weaknesses, and he still got killed. Tyrion has all kinds of weaknesses, and he is still alive. What was Overyn's weakness? Pride I guess, lust for vengeance. What's Ramsay and Roose's weakness and what was Stannis' weakness?
     
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  10. fanatic

    fanatic Habitual Line Stepper

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    Thanks for the back story. So Jon wasn't Ned's bastard? He was Lyanna (Ned's sister) son? If so, I wonder why he let Kat believe he was unfaithful to her. Surely he could have told his wife the truth.

    Also, what episode was the tower of joy scene? I don't recall that.
     

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