The NCAA rules require coaches to tell the NCAA if they are aware that someone is breaking the rules. The only problem I have is if Bama didn't do what they were found guilty of doing. If they cheated (and it doesn't seem that they are arguing that they didn't cheat), they got what they deserved. A "but he did it, too" argument didn't work for my three year old, and it doesn't work for a university.
I don't have a problem with the NCAA's sanctions against Bama, what I have a problem with is the various forms of immunity that the NCAA obviously rewarded to Phat Phil for being a snitch. While prosecutors and cops rely on snitches, it is a questionable tactic, since the credibility of the snitch is always an issue. The NCAA is not a law enforcement agency, and it should refrain from that tactic, especially when the snitch can gain a competitive advantage if the NCAA imposes sanctions on an opponent based on the information provided by the snitch. If you have two kids who both did something wrong, do you let the kid who told first on the other one escape any consequences for their own wrong behavior?
The problem we at Alabama have with the NCAA, or should I say one of the many problems is the severity of the sanctions. The NCAA did not hand down a LOIC or FTM charge against Alabama and no university had been given any bowl bans or other sanctions as severe as they handed Alabama without those charges. Never, none since and none prior. Too many people think Alabama pleaded guilty to all the charges levied against them. Not true at all. We did not plead guilty to any major infractions only some minor infractions. Below is a copy of the actual plea. From the Public Response to The NCAA Letter of Official Inquiry (12/6/01) Allegation No. 1 (**Kenny Smith**): "The University agrees that during the first recruitment of a prospective student-athlete, in which the prospect signed a letter to play at The University of Alabama, this prospective student athlete received substantial cash payment(s) from a representative of the University's athletic interests who was subsequently disassociated for his involvement in this allegation. The University also agrees that during his second recruitment, when he signed a National Letter of Intent to play at another institution (and in fact subsequently enrolled at another institution), this prospective student athlete and/or his family, received offers of substantial additional payments to sign with the University of Alabama. "The University does not agree that the evidence is sufficient to support a conclusion as to the source of the funds actually provided during the first recruitment or offered during the second recruitment. "It is the University's position that this allegation is barred by the NCAA statute of limitations governing NCAA enforcement proceedings, and that therefore no additional penalties should be assessed based on it. The University believes that, although the this allegation, if proved, would constitute a significant NCAA rules violation, any impremissible conduct occured more than four years prior to the issuance of the Official Inquiry, and the NCAA Enforcement Staff had notice of these matters substantially more than one year prior to September 5, 2001, the date of the official inquiry." Allegation No. 2 (**Booster Purchase of Meals for Kenny Smith**): "The University agrees that this allegation is accurate. Allegation No. 3 (**Albert Means/$115,000 to Lynn Lang): "The NCAA withdrew assistant coach Ivy Williams from this allegation. "The University agrees with some parts of this allegation, but does not agree the evidence is sufficient to establish others. The University agrees that the high school coaches of this prospective student athlete solicited funds or other things of value for themselves in order to influence the student's decision on college choice. The University does not agree that the evidence is sufficient to support a conclusion as to the allegations of actual peyment(s) or their source. "The University also takes the position that the self-imposed corrective and remedial measures it has undertaken are a full and sufficient response to this allegation. The University believes that no additional penalties should be assessed for its having impermissibly gained a "competitive advantage" from having played this student athlete for the 2000 season. The position is based on the fact that the relevant enforcement officials had sufficient prior knowledge of the improprieties surrounding the recruitment of this student, both before and after he signed a National Letter of Intent with The University of Alabama, and failed to notify Universiy officials in time to have prevented any competitive advantage being gained." Allegation No. 4 (**Cottrell/Young Loan**): "The Unviersity agrees that the allegations concerning the financial transactions involving a former member of the coaching staff are accurate. It does not take a position on the allegation that the former coach provided misleading information concerning these transactions during the investigation." Allegation No. 5 (**Michael Gaines**): "The NCAA Enforcement Staff withdrew Allegations Nos. 5A and 5B. "The University agrees with the remaining portion of the allegation (i.e., 5C) that a prospective student athlete was impermissibly allowed to make long distance telephone calls without charge and that this remaining portion of the allegation is secondary." Allegation No. 6 (**Extra expense money on Albert Means' visit**): "The NCAA Enforcement Staff withdrew the allegation that two nights' lodging were provided to a high school coach at no cost. "The University agrees that this allegation is substantially correct." Allegation No. 7 (**Travis Carroll's vehicle**): "The University disagrees with this allegation. It does not agree that the automobile transaction described in the allegation constitutes a violation of NCAA rules." Allegation No. 8 (**A Booster gave $500 To Travis Carroll**): "The University agrees that the facts alleged possibly occured, but notes that the only available evidence is contradictory." Allegation No. 9 (**Improper Booster/Prospect Contact at Summer Camp**): "The University agrees that this allegation is accurate." Allegation No. 10 (**Strippers**): "The University agrees that this allegation is accurate. Allegation No. 11 (**Ivy Williams Unethical Conduct**): "The NCAA Enforcement Staff withdrew this allegation." Allegations No. 12-16 were self-reported by the University and were determined to be secondary in nature. As you can see the NCAA hammered us on hearsay accusations made by people the University was not allowed to cross examine. The Law Firm of Cunningham Bounds was not allowed to cross examine them in our appeal either. Kind of a one sided trial. Once again I want to reiterate the University does not seek any reprieve from the sanctions handed down. Those sanctions basically come to an end on Feburary 4, 2004 which is only 10 days away. None of the trials concerning Ronnie Cottrell, Ivy Williams or Logan Young have even seated a jury at this time so there will be no verdicts handed down anytime soon. The University has moved on, it is those who were wronged by the NCAA that haven't. Does anyone find it strange that the NCAA sent the University of Alabama a letter finally releasing the University from any further findings in the Memphis hearings? It was sent on the same day the documents from the Logan Young disclosure hearings were made public. I apologize for being so long winded and taking up so much space but so many people have been brainwashed as to just what Alabama pleaded guilty to and what could actually be proven against them. And I do appreciate all the civil replies.
cheating/snitch? Just a redneck point of view. Scenerio: I coach for BTF (big time football). I am trying to do right. But how the h### do I know what a rich booster offers a recruit? There are some recruits that everyone is after. What control do I have over some millionaire telling a high school senior that he will give his family $250,000 if he will play at BTF? If the kid comes from a poor family that only makes $20,000 a year, how much could that help his family? He may love LSU and hate BTF, but I bet he loves his family. We get caught. BTF says that I can no longer be associated with the university as a booster. What does that mean? It SAVES me money! BTF can no longer take my GENEROUS contributions. Do you really think I can no longer have access to GOOD tickets? Second scenerio: I am still coach at BTF. Salary is $175,000 a year plus perks. Been coach for eight years. I find out the coach at LSU has been cheating. First of all, this hurts my future. Second reason to turn him in, this hurts my future. Same third reason. We are not talking management positions at Wendy's. I could sell my house and make more than most folks make in five years. WOULD I TELL ON YOU? You bet. One more point. I would make it PERFECTLY CLEAR to all the coaches and any pertinent people around me, that if I found out that they were guilty of doing ANYTHING that would hurt me or BTF/LSU, I would do all I could to help hang your butt. If you were innocent, I would go to all extremes to help you. But don't hang me out.
None of us are arguing that violations should not be reported. The disagreement is the way they were reported and what the NCAA did with hearsay evidence. Proven charges should absoulutely be punished but anyone can make up stuff or take things out of context to build some kind of case. It's just like everyone thinking Alabama pleaded guilty to everything and I just posted exactly what we pleaded guilty to. It's a far cry from all charges. Fullmer broke trust and the NCAA broke their own by-laws.
ncaa I may be wrong, but the ncaa has no real presedent to follow. They have absolute POWER. There is no Maranda rule to follow. If they want to go in, they go in. If they get it in for you or your school, you are in deep crap. They can threaten, cajole, berate, or simply vote in favor of extreme punishment. You have NO recoil. It must be nice to be that powerful and have no one to answer to. If the discord got so bad that many of the POWERFUL schools chose to reorganize, can you imagine the turmoil? Would it ever be worth it? Would it ruin college football? Possibly. And the ncaa knows it and uses it to it's advantage. Is the ncaa/bcs system fair? Who knows? I'll never believe some one like LSU should meet some one like Illinois State or even Southern Miss. for the national title. But how FAIR is it?
Re: ncaa Congress and Law Enforcement don't even have that kind of power. The NCAA=Gestopo College football=fair? I don't think so................... This year proved it, you had OU, a team that lost thier conference championship game play for the National Championship. USC, a team that didn't play the schedule LSU and OU did and were voted#1? by whom? Is it fair to have coaches and Fowler, etc vote rankings and then some Coaches pass thier voting to others? That shows just how much the coaches care to vote, I think the human polls should be done away with. I will enjoy watching this team play games on the football field on my DVD's and enjoy the season over and over. But, I'm glad its over, I don't like the way college football is run! I hope USC falls into the ocean! not because they were voted #1, but the character of the coach and the team. This end of this season truely made me SICK! Except for our accomplishments on the field.
Two Cheaters Pointing Fingers at Each Other..... You did this.......... Well, you did that........ The teams that ought to be pissed off at this crap are the other 10 SEC schools who have been subjected to this CRAP from both Bama & Tennessee for several years now. Let's face it, Bama DESERVED probation and would have gotten it eventually with or without Fulmer and his B.S. Now, if Tennessee deserves probation as well, then so be it. The bottom line is that neither school is innocent and this story is just friggin' WORN THE PHUCK OUT!!! If these two schools can't get their shit together and stop dragging the entire SEC down, I am for the SEC penalizing both of them. This crap is just old and is going nowhere. MEANWHILE................ LSU 2003 SEC & National Champions. GEAUX TIGERS!!!
you are too funny,, you should be lucky your school wasnt in the bulleye Yet, If this attorney can help clean up the NCAA,, if I were any other SEC school, I would hope he does it. If Phil would have done this to your Tigers... come on,, and you find out two years later,,, you would want blood and you know it!!!!
