Morals

Discussion in 'Free Speech Alley' started by CParso, May 4, 2005.

  1. CParso

    CParso Founding Member

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    There's been alot of talk around here lately about the decline of general morality in America. It makes me curious what some of your solutions would be?

    The problem, it seems to me, is that there's a tradeoff between freedom and morality (atleast when the government is involved).

    Thoughts? Suggestions? Possible policies?
     
  2. saltyone

    saltyone So Mote It Be

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    Unfortunately, the old saying is usually true... You can never go back.

    The slippery slope of the "if it feels good then do it" mentality can only be combated by a strong positive influence of family and friends and a belief that there are consequences to our actions here on earth.
     
  3. JSracing

    JSracing Founding Member

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    it's very hard to legislate morality.

    Instead, if the courts would enforce the laws already on the books and go back to some sort of truth in sentencing, even if they had to build prisons.

    Basically, if you do the crime, you should do the time. that MIGHT help.

    I'm not talking about death sentence or anything like that, although I'm for it.

    I'm just saying UPHOLD the laws that are already out there instead of slapping criminals on the hands.

    In my way of thinking there are "levels" of discipline" in our world.

    1. Home... years ago kids were taught right from wrong and "seemed" to get into less violent crimes. sure there was always crime and a very bad criminal element, but it seemed it was less rampant among oridnary teens.

    2.nd level. Society.... basically if Mom and Dad couldnt teach you right from wrong at some basic level, society must either teach it to you, incarcerate you, or execute you to protect the rest of society.

    3rd. God. I know some people don't believe this way but here goes.
    If all else fails, you'll be judged in the next world. For some I guess there wont be one. I would like to believe he is first, but you have to be taught this by someone. and his judgement is last and final, hence the 3rd position on the list. this was taught along with morals and was an incentive to be a better person in society. Do unto others so to speak.

    IMHO--- the best way is the first one, while being taught the third one, where the family has a Mom and a Dad that passes on some basic values, however basic they may be.

    this one isnt being done, so the second one has to kick in to protect the rest of society. Now the second one is slowly eroding in lieu of the almighty dollar, justice can be bought now. So I guess it's on to the third level. God will judge in the end.

    If you're a history buff, you can draw uncanny parralells to the state of our country and attitude now, to the Roman's right before the fall of the empire. I'm not saying anything is about to happen, but it is weird, the decline in morality and the advent of the end. We should learn from History, so you'd think.

    BTW i don't think freedom and morality are opposites, look up the definaition of each. You can have all the freedom you want, freedom of speech, assembly, whatever. Just can't do it if it is going to hurt someone else and their right to the pursuit of happiness. You can have alot of freedom as long as it doesn't infringe on the basic principles set forth in the Declaration of Independance and the Preamble of the US Constituion below.


    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,



    We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquillity, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
     
  4. Sourdoughman

    Sourdoughman TigerFan of LSU and the Tigerman

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    I agree with Saltyone and JSracingBBF.
    I will also throw in the mix that prison overcrowding probably has become a problem and is the reason if you do the crime you no longer have to do the time!

    Separation of Church and State, flame away,
    IMHO, Ever since the Separation of church and state we have been sliding down the slippery slope backwards.
    It would be better to teach about all religions in school instead of the evolution theory
    only.
    People no longer have consequences for their actions!
    I will also throw the borders in the mix, we have a lot of bad apples crossing the borders also.

    Morals? Or lack there of! :cry:
     
  5. Mystikalilusion

    Mystikalilusion Founding Member

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    If religion is the only thing keeping you from doing very bad things, maybe you should reevaluate.
     
  6. Sourdoughman

    Sourdoughman TigerFan of LSU and the Tigerman

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    Not talking about myself but others...
    It is true about others IMHO.
    Maybe you should re-evaluate! :hihi:
     
  7. red55

    red55 curmudgeon Staff Member

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    The problem with determining if morals have declined and even more so with any futile attempt at enforcing morality standards is that one man's "key moral issue" is often another man's "no big deal".

    Morality is a very personal issue and where the line is drawn is never obvious if more than one person is involved. Of course, there are moral issues on which there is clear agreement--murder for instance. But other issues are quite muddy and many are very controversial.

    Jerry Falwell's morality is no more representative of middle America than is Hugh Hefner's. And middle America itself has a broad range of moral issues on which there is no consensus.

    The balance between personal morality and personal freedom is a key issue to individuals. But there are also public morality issues, which must be addressed in government and public forums. The sticking point here is determining which morality issues are of public concern and which issues are private and personal and nobody's business. It's not an easy or straightforward formula.
     
  8. Mystikalilusion

    Mystikalilusion Founding Member

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    My god, why does everything have to be about you? You can obviously tell from my post, I wasn't calling you out Doughboy, my statement (like yours) was made about human beings in general.

    I agree with Red, "morals" are a pretty subjective item.
     
  9. LSUDeek

    LSUDeek All That She Wants...

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    I really don't understand the moderate, centrist viewpoints.

    There is a RIGHT, and there is a WRONG. It may be unconstitutional in our country to legislate certain things, but that doesn't make them any less wrong. Natural man knows this, even in our fallen state. We just chose and still choose to be our own gods and determine for ourselves what is right and wrong.
     
  10. Mystikalilusion

    Mystikalilusion Founding Member

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    I disagree. There is a legal right and a legal wrong.

    Beyond that, every individual has the freedom to determine their own moral code/system, within the boundries of that legal right, if you are willing to live with the social ramifications. Your last line is correct, we ARE able to determine what is right and what is wrong.

    ie, It is not illegal to sleep with your sibling if you both consent. If two adults do so, it is not illegal. Whether or not it is immoral, is to be determined by the two adults in question, within the social environment. (an extreme example to be sure, but an example nevertheless.)
     

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